Posh gits and (upper-)class heroes

[mirrorshard]

The very rich are not like you and I.
No, they have more money.

Yes, this is a post about Boris Johnson. Feel free to skip.

A lot of the Boris-criticism-criticism I've been seeing lately can be more or less summed up as "don't hate him for being a posh Tory prat". After all, we wouldn't dream of saying that someone wasn't qualified for an elected position because they were too working-class, right?

The problem with that is that the two aren't equivalent. Because our Mayor has always been rich, he's always been privileged and insulated - he's been surrounded by other people of his own class, race, and wealth level to a greater extent than any council-estate hoodie, first at private school and then at Oxbridge. He's never been forced to work at something he didn't want to do, never run the risk of homelessness or bad credit, never had to live hand to mouth. (To the best of my knowledge, at least. I may be wrong about that. If so, please correct me.)

The fact that he went to Eton depresses me more than the Oxford education - after all, many people manage to get through Oxford without being ruined. (And I should stress that this isn't linked to party affiliation. At the moment, they're all posh gits.) But he was a member of the Bullingdon Club, like Cameron, there. For those of you not familiar with the term, they're a bunch of yobs who dress up in penguin costumes and go out to smash up restaurants.

So, like David Cameron (notorious for surrounding himself with others of his own background) he has a far smaller range of people he can identify with, empathise with, and relate to than someone like Ken Livingstone with a more rounded education and socialization. I'm not trying to say he can't, or that he has no interest in it - just that being a posh toff brings with it a lot of disadvantages when it comes to relating to ordinary people, and posh toffs are statistically much more likely to be out of touch with ordinary people than the rest of us are.

What I'd like to see - though there are more than a few problems with the idea - is a rule that nobody can stand for public office unless they've spent at least six months on Government benefits in the past.

Comments

[malvino.livejournal.com]

The fact is that he didn't get to chose to be born rich, and there's no reason why he should be excluded from direct participation in democracy just because he was. Oh, and I've never been on benefits, I don't think it's the norm.

[thekumquat.livejournal.com]

While I agree with your first sentence, Boris doesn't appear to have made any efforts to understand non-rich life - although he clearly has made himself electable so could well have made such efforts and publicised them in outer London, just not inner London.
Or more succintly: I don't oppose him for being a post Tory prat, just for being a prat.

Some years ago I found that among all my friends (aged 25-30ish), I and one other were the only ones never to have been made redundant and thus gone on the dole, and that was because we were doing PhDs and never had jobs to become redundant from. I think both of us had claimed benefit previously. I don't know how representative that is, though, given I don't know a single Boris voter...

[mirrorshard.livejournal.com]

I'd suspect that Boris voters are a bit less likely to have claimed benefits in the past, but that's just a gut feeling. It may depend partly on how much of the National Front (and other piccaninny-hating) vote he drained away.

[malvino.livejournal.com]

I've been made redundant several times but never gone on the dole. Although I wouldn't vote for him either and think the people who did are morons, in principle I could vote for an Eton/Oxbridge man if he was sound. Opposing him for who he is is fine, opposing him for how he was born, is, to me, bigotted.

[mirrorshard.livejournal.com]

It's not just a matter of how he was born - it's down to how he's dealt with his disadvantages.

[malvino.livejournal.com]

So he should have flushed all his money and refused high paying jobs until he was eligable for benefits?

[mirrorshard.livejournal.com]

I don't know offhand what proportion of the population have - and I agree that people shouldn't be excluded - but it is pretty common.

To expand the notion of benefits slightly, I got free school meals as a child; I got a full government grant to go to university; I've been on jobseekers' allowance (or whatever they were calling it that year) twice, and on income support for quite a long period.

If I could find a better metric for "not being permanently financially secure" I would.

[malvino.livejournal.com]

Why is that such an issue, is money more important than anything else? What about people how have never had kids? How can they know what it's like to raise children and therfore represent those who are parent? What about people who have never been ethnic minorities, or the victims of crime, or disabled. No representative, or even delegate, can ever fully understand the concerns of every individual he speak for.

[mirrorshard.livejournal.com]

Being poor isn't about money; it's about power.

[friend-of-tofu.livejournal.com]

I've spent quite some time on benefits, and I come from a middle-income background and have a degree and 2 post-grad qualifications. Almost everyone I grew up with, and most of them weren't really poor (many of them went to some sort of private school) has spent at least a few weeks on benefits, mostly more. Most of them are in reasonably well-paid jobs now, but that doesn't mean they didn't all really need the benefits at the time.

[malvino.livejournal.com]

Good for you. I never went on benefits, I did crappy temping jobs for peanuts instead.

[friend-of-tofu.livejournal.com]

I actually did both at one point: I was earning so little at my 30+ hours a week job that I qualified. One of my friends was STILL earning so little at his retail job last year (at the age of 28) that he was getting housing benefit, despite often working a 6 day week.

I was over the moon when the minimum wage came in, as you can imagine.

My point was not to gain some kind of spurious prestige by mentioning that I and most of the people I know have been on benefits at some point - I'm not expecting a pat on the back - but to point out that it's actually pretty damn ordinary, and it's very likely that a *large* number of people in this country are or have been relying on benefits at some point. Including many people who are not typically regarded as benefit claimant material.

[purplecthulhu.livejournal.com]

he's been surrounded by other people of his own ... race

You do know his wife is half-indian don't you? His mother-in-law is called Dip Singh.

[mirrorshard.livejournal.com]

I didn't, actually - thank you for the clarification. That does help a bit, but it's one counterexample. I'm not in any sense accusing him of active racism or bigotry, but there is that early inexperience and insulation still.

[purplecthulhu.livejournal.com]

Fair enough - I have to say I was surprised to discover this over the weekend myself, which means that either he or the media haven't been making much of it in spite of all the racist allegations going round. If it's his decision not to bring it up that's to his credit, if it's the media playing it down that's to their discredit.

I'd submit, though, that his marriage would suggest he's got over any early inexperience and insulation which wouldn't have been his fault anyway.

[friend-of-tofu.livejournal.com]

I'd submit, though, that his marriage would suggest he's got over any early inexperience and insulation which wouldn't have been his fault anyway.

Sorry, I think that's nonsense, as I have said below.

[friend-of-tofu.livejournal.com]

a rule that nobody can stand for public office unless they've spent at least six months on Government benefits in the past

I would support that policy :¬)

Or, they can just receive minimum wage for their public office. That'd do me. Might make Bozzer a bit keener on the minimum wage, methinks!

On the point about racism - it is quite possible for people to be tolerant of one race but hateful, rude or just plain crass about another. Additionally, when I was married to a non-white partner, I observed some pretty shocking examples of racism in their family (British Asian). Just because his wife is half-Indian doesn't make his remarks about watermelon smiles and picininnies any more acceptable.

[souldier-blue.livejournal.com]

When I was unemployed I didn't qualify for benefits as my partner was earning minimum wage in a temp job.

[mirrorshard.livejournal.com]

Another good point. Obviously, the metric'd have to be much more complex than 'on benefits', but I still think it's a good starting point.

[friend-of-tofu.livejournal.com]

You didn't qualify for housing benefit on the sliding scale? I'm surprised by that, that sounds like an incorrect assessment if your partner was on minimum wage.

[souldier-blue.livejournal.com]

This was when I'd just finished Uni, so there was no such thing as a legal minimum wage; I'd moved in with my boyfriend as I had nowhere else to go, and he was earning the lowest pay bracket that temp agencies offered at that time, as he'd dropped out of Uni a few months earlier. We were renting a room in a shared house. Maybe the assessment was wrong or maybe things have changed since then?

[friend-of-tofu.livejournal.com]

I remember that well cos was in the same position as you when I was 17/18.

In all honesty, knowing what I know now, I think the assessment was probably wrong, because they often are - even then, job centre staff were undertrained and overworked. However, I, like you, had no idea how to go any further with that, or even to know enough to question the decision. One very stupid assumption often made is that if a person doesn't qualify for an income-related benefit, they won't bother with a housing benefit calculation.

However, it's definitely the case that, since then, it has become easier to claim benefits separately, as it were, and to claim small amounts of benefits while not qualifying for larger ones. Hence the move to things like tax credits.

I'm not even going to start here on my concerns about the way these allow employers to get away with paying poor wages, however, because I can really go on about that kind of thing...

[midnightmelody.livejournal.com]

Inexperience and insulation seems to be a totally different issue from 'first-hand personal experience'. For example, most TeachFirst recruits haven't ever been on benefits, but the daily experience of working with pupils from less privileged backgrounds hardly equates to an insulated or inexperienced viewpoint.

[mirrorshard.livejournal.com]

Another good point. On the other hand, not everyone does benefit from that second-hand experience - I suspect TeachFirst recruits are rather more likely to be good, open people than the general population, and to take away useful lessons from it.

But it's still second-hand experience, and one runs the risk of overvaluing it - the 'Why, some of my best friends are poor people' stereotype is a lot less real than it used to be, but it's still around.

[friend-of-tofu.livejournal.com]

the 'Why, some of my best friends are poor people' stereotype is a lot less real than it used to be, but it's still around.

Yes, because it IS hard to understand the impact it has unless you've lived it. And I've not even lived it very much!

Some people will actually try, though.