-i[s/z]e

[mirrorshard]

Words ending therewith, as requested by nou.

The rule I use - which I think I learned from Fowler, many years ago, but don't have it handy to check - is that if the word stem can stand on its own, you use -ize, and otherwise -ise.

Therefore, advertise, but ionize (ie. to make something into an ion - 'advert' is a back-formation from 'advertisement'). Politics can be radicalized, and negative effects minimized, but one usually has to compromise somewhere.

There are more complex etymological explanations for this, but I'm not going to go into them, partly because they're (almost) all special cases and exceptions. Insofar as English is amenable to rules like this, this one works.

Besides, it's a good excuse to use more Zs, and there aren't nearly enough of them.

[Poll #738721]

Comments

[dasquian.livejournal.com]

I always thought (probably incorrectly) that -ise is English English and -ize is American English. I can't think of any examples where -ize is "right" or more right than -ise, though I am sure there are loads of obvious ones ;p

[dasquian.livejournal.com]

Actually you're right. Ionize and galvanize *are* more right... am I right in guessing that these words were invented by American scientists? I suspect it's only more modern words coined in America which seem more right using -ize.

I certainly wouldn't say "galvanise", that's just stupid.

[mirrorshard.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure offhand - galvanism and galvanic are from the eighteenth-century Italian scientist Professore Galvani, but I have a definite feeling that the process wasn't used for electroplating till quite a bit later. I should possibly do some research later.

[kake]

More right in what sense? In that they feel more right to you, or that you've never seen any house style which considers them acceptable?

[yaqub.livejournal.com]

This is actually the first time that I've seen this rule. I always heard about the difference being American and British, rather than anything else.

Then again, my learning of the English language consists of a pretty basic secondary school English, added with learning bits and pieces on the go, like subtitles in films and asking questions and looking stuff up in dictionaries.

[reuss.livejournal.com]

You missed an option box: I am too tired/stupid/other to understand your rule right now, please elaborate.

[mirrorshard.livejournal.com]

Oops, I do apologise. Let's see what I can do.

If the rest of the word, disregarding the -i(s/z)e, still makes sense on its own (eg. ion, radical), then it should get a Z. The default case would be with an S. Some words are a bit dodgy that way (eg. minim), but most of them are fairly clear (eg. comprom).

[martling.livejournal.com]

I had also thought this was just a US/UK thing.

[mirrorshard.livejournal.com]

I've been told this in the past, but inconsistently so - different rules by different American friends. I suspect it depends on your upbringing and education.

[kake]

Wikipedia provides some thoughts on this, and an interesting link.

[kake]

I'm not sure I like this rule. It seems insufficiently deterministic. The cases of "minim" and "advert" could be argued either way.

I also seem to remember when we first discussed this that you said using both "ise" and "ize" provides additional information - but is it useful information? Is it useful for me to know that you think "minim" and "advert" are qualitatively different words? I don't think it's useful in the way that making a distinction between "practice" and "practise" is.

I go for consistency. Either use "ise" throughout, or use "ize" throughout.

[kake]

Thinking about it a bit more, it seems like I might like it better if I look at it as a way to determine when "ize" would be considered incorrect. The link I posted in reply to Martin actually seems to be saying sort of the same thing as you, but with a different focus.

[mirrorshard.livejournal.com]

That seems pretty much the way I use it - not deterministically, but as a way to test edge cases.